"Conversations"WILL THERE BE TWO AMERICAS?
THE SPECTER OF CIVIL WAR
dream and its interpretation......
From: Bill MacPherson
Sometime in 2009 I had a very disturbing dream. In the dream, I was in my parents’ home in Connecticut where I lived as a teenager. What I can only describe as a messenger of the Lord came into my bedroom and awakened me, telling me to come quickly, that he had something to show me. I followed him out into the hallway where he pointed to a beat-up old dresser and asked me, "What do you see?" On the dresser was a simple black plastic flag stand with two criss-crossed miniature American flags.
I responded, "I see two flags", whereupon he replied, "you see correctly. Quickly, go and tell everyone you see, there will be two Americas." I rushed into my parents’ bedroom which was filled with people milling about as far as I could see. I started yelling, "There will be two Americas! There will be two Americas!" People's response ranged from indifference to contempt. I was shocked and thought, "I have absolutely no idea what I am talking about." I turned to ask the messenger, "What does this mean?" but he was gone and I woke up.
Since then, the Holy Spirit has brought this dream to mind on several occasions, often while following rapidly evolving political and economic events. I don't presume to have an interpretation but the dream has prompted me to pray for the United States. Was God speaking to me? What was he saying? Why me?
What do you think?
I am rather intrigued by your dream. It seems to speak to something I have pondered on over the years but have not had a good way to understand.
Over the years there have been many dreams, visions and prophecies about future America. The flow of these has been contrary. On one hand there have been prophecies about America under judgment, specifically under police state conditions and invasion by foreign armies, not to mention natural destruction. But then there have been other prophecies about faithful protected remnants throughout America, though often described as dwelling in various strategic places. Normally, when one thinks about a nation prophetically, the nation is perceived as an indivisible entirety. But thought of as such, it is hard to make sense of these differing flows of national prophecy seeing they can’t both be true applied to the nation as one.
As I have sought to comprehend these contrary prophetic flows, I have always instead come up with a picture of something more like a Swiss cheese swirl of black and white strands, something like a marble cake—maybe something not unlike the patchwork of city states that comprised Northern Europe in the Middle Ages before they consolidated into larger nations now known as Germany, France, etc. In the light of these contrary strands and your dream, what I can see is a divided nation in which God is essentially dealing with two different spiritual people groups throughout the whole.
There is that lesser but “purer” stream that has sought to use their American experience to advance the spiritual kingdom of God in the land as true uncompromising disciples. And there is the larger stream of those who have used the American experience to advance themselves, their ministries and grow fat on the American way of life—something primarily responsible for the overall descent of America into a slave state.
In His own prophecies, Jesus repeatedly references two groups of people that are increasingly separated out as the end advances. It would seem that such separation is so marked that it does not merely divide the kind of churches found within a nation, but it divides the very fabric of national life itself. And so that is why there would be these conflictory flows within the same national entity, or otherwise the prediction of “two Americas.” Revelation 12-13 portrays a worldwide beast of oppression upon all peoples, yet a woman that escapes the beast to be cared for in the desert. This too could find fulfillment through an understanding of divided national fabric somehow.
Of course, because we are all so used to thinking in terms of “one” nation, the practical fulfillment of a prophetic two nation-within-one scenario is tough to grasp. And yet we look around us every day, and there is perpetual social divide in the country, and it is increasing all the time—and on so many levels. There will have to be a breaking point somewhere. What will that look like? –What kind of spiritual war turned civil war even?
Maybe through this God is trying to give us a better understanding of what the two sided harvest will really look like worldwide, and that the appearance of the kingdom itself in manifest glory may not be as much as a blazing singular takeover from above as it is a rising up overcoming of the smaller “white” strand over the larger “black” strand through cataclysmic confrontation—even as Rebekah was told “two peoples are struggling within your womb, and the elder will serve the younger.” Where we have always thought of America as a singular “Rebekah” entity, perhaps now the Lord is saying we must see it as divided twins struggling for supremacy in the land.
Thoughts to consider.
From: Bill Macpherson
There will be two Americas?
Will The Election Results Cause Massive Riots To Erupt All Over America?
at the Warren County Democratic headquarters, just north
of Cincinnati, were shocked and disappointed by a
political prank unloaded on them early Tuesday morning –
someone dumped a pile of horse manure in the parking lot
of the headquarters building on US 42, just north of
How sick is that?
Eight years ago, shortly after the 2004 election, David Gergen, former political advisor to four presidents, and PBS / CNN political commentary regular came to Roger Williams Univ. in R.I. to speak on healing the political divide in the country. That election was more openly bitter than the current one has become yet.
After the speech, I went up and asked him if he saw any parallel between where the country was now politically and where it was in the years before the Civil War, and could he foresee the possibility of another American Civil War. His eyes suddenly narrowed and brow furrowed, and he said to me that he was concerned, and that if something did not intervene to change the framework of political dialogue, he could indeed foresee that as a very real possibility. But he didn’t want to talk about it.
The Civil War did not happen overnight. Its seeds were sown into the nation’s original fabric. From the beginning compromises had to be made with the South to gain their concurrence with becoming part of national union. (Slaves were agreed to be counted as 3/5 of a person!) It then took “four score and seven years” for that fissure to fully develop. After 1800, states were added based on preserving the balance of power between Slave and non-slave states. None of the balances or compromises ever healed the underlying divide. The underlying division festered all the more and war became inevitable.
Over the last century, especially since the Russian revolution, a similar societal divide has developed in America between atheistic amoral socialism and theistic moral free enterprise philosophy. That fissure has maintained itself at the center of political debate and has never been settled, now defining the essence of platform under each of the two major political parties.
The tension between these philosophies has mushroomed to a near breaking point, as Gergen conceded, and as the article you sent out only reinforces. The question may be, which election cycle is it that will tip the balance so as to spark open war. Last time, it was the election of 1860. Could it now be the election of 2012, or may it yet be delayed a cycle or two? We don’t really know yet. But we will see what comes after this election.
What complicates things is that there are multiple levels of divide that remain unsettled. I’ve already written about the growing contention between the organic and corporate governments since 1871 and the issue of monetary and regulatory slavery to the corporate entity as that slavery becomes increasingly exposed for what it is.
In July 1995 I attended a workshop by Steve Fry on Worship Megatrends. In his lecture, Steve relayed a story about a friend of his who had connections to the top military brass in the country. These connections told Steve’s friend that military plans were already being drawn up in anticipation of another civil war in the United States—except that this war was expected to be a war between economic classes (the “haves” vs. the “have nots”) rather than racial classes.
The anticipated framework for that war was “within 25 years.” Having already seen the Tea Party and Occupy Wall Street protests, we can only ask, how close are we to that prediction now?
Then there is also the remaining racial divide. The Civil War did not really heal the racial divide. It has been a slow road for blacks to gain “equality” in American society ever since. (The “melting pot” has never truly been a melting pot in the consciousness of the larger American racial streams, black or white or Hispanic.)
But all these divides fall into the class of conflict Christ said would occur in the world before His coming. For me, the most significant divide is between the ready and the unready church in the face of these earthly fissures which I wrote you about last summer (above).
I do think a conflagration is coming and it will not be avoidable because, despite the efforts of the intercession movements, most intercessors have not lost enough of their identity in America to really have the mind of God for America. Most are too heavily invested in racial and political roots, hence in one side or the other, to pray authoritatively. They are actually part of the problem. But what I do know is that God is going to use these “wars and rumors of war” to ultimately perfect the church and lead it out of Babylon and into the true kingdom. This is the thing I am watching most for out of all these things.
Chris AndersonFirst Love Ministry
- a ministry of Anglemar Fellowship
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Page created May 23, 2017